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	<title>Comments on: &#8220;What will I tell my gay friends?&#8221;</title>
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		<title>By: Kev Jang</title>
		<link>http://www.conversiondiary.com/2007/08/what-will-i-tell-my-gay-friends.html/comment-page-1#comment-41662</link>
		<dc:creator>Kev Jang</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Jan 2012 03:50:23 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>SH wrote : I think gays (esp. male gays) have much harder temptations because they can find sexual gratification very easily. That must make it harder to resist. It must be similar to being an alcoholic vs. being a marijuana smoker. Alcohol is available at your corner store, but how do you buy marijuana even if you wanted it?
 
Also, I have a gay brother, and I have been close with many of his friends over the decades. The one thing that has always struck me is that they don’t really “bond” like male-females do. They are more like good friends who are roommates who have sex with each other. I’ll give a few examples. First, gay couples (at least, gay male couples) very, very often have multiple sexual partners. Orgies (and drugs) are common in gay culture. A lifelong, monogamous bond is very rare. Second, when gay men “get married” they almost never pool their resources fully the way that male-female couples do. If one comes into the relationship with a lot of money and the other with none, you can bet that the large sum of money is going to stay in an account in the rich guy’s name. But husbands routinely hand everything over to their wives and treat it as “community” property. People can disagree with me on these things, but I’ve seen them again and again and again over several decades with my brother’s friends. I know I am right. There is a very different and less bonded, less profound “feel” to a gay male relationship than to your typical male-female marriage. Third, when gay men get sick, of AIDS for example, their party boy friends disappear within a few months. The people you will find at their bedsides are their mothers, their sisters, their female friends, and occasionally a father, brother, or good male friend or two. That has been my experience. Lots of gay men can vouch for me on this one, but unfortunately they are all dead. The living gay men probably don’t want to acknowledge that this is true and that they are surrounded by so much temporary “loyalty.” A life lived without women is not much of a life. 

_____
SH, your dilemma of wanting to show Christian love to people living in that lifestyle and yet making a stand for what our faith states is a real dilemma many Christians face. It is easy to jump to conclusions or to judge and condemn homosexuals or those living that lifestyle, when we need to remember too that heterosexuals are about as knee-deep in sins like fornication, sexual promiscuity and so on, and also, deep down inside, what homosexuals search for like all of us regardless of orientation is a need for meaningful relationship. Without meaningful relationship, all humans--homosexual, heterosexual, bisexual or whatever--are bound to fail in the way they understand themselves and their purpose in relation to God and the church too. 

A few of my best friends are gay and live the homosexual lifestyle. Granted that some of them do not make the best of choices and enter relationships based more on the need to satiate sexual yearnings, with the element of the &quot;utility&quot; of human bodies thrown in(my best friend himself gets attracted to muscular men who are like himself, an alpha-male by American standards), I think that deep down inside, there is really an emptiness sitting in within the homosexual lifestyle, and it starts very much with the need for meaningful relationships of a platonic nature with the same sex for them. If many of them had been loved unconditionally regardless and despite of their sexuality, and loved for the image of God which still resides in them, then perhaps we as Christians would not have driven them away from the church and from Biblical scriptures as well, but would have admonished them in a way to come to seek healing in Christ.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>SH wrote : I think gays (esp. male gays) have much harder temptations because they can find sexual gratification very easily. That must make it harder to resist. It must be similar to being an alcoholic vs. being a marijuana smoker. Alcohol is available at your corner store, but how do you buy marijuana even if you wanted it?</p>
<p>Also, I have a gay brother, and I have been close with many of his friends over the decades. The one thing that has always struck me is that they don’t really “bond” like male-females do. They are more like good friends who are roommates who have sex with each other. I’ll give a few examples. First, gay couples (at least, gay male couples) very, very often have multiple sexual partners. Orgies (and drugs) are common in gay culture. A lifelong, monogamous bond is very rare. Second, when gay men “get married” they almost never pool their resources fully the way that male-female couples do. If one comes into the relationship with a lot of money and the other with none, you can bet that the large sum of money is going to stay in an account in the rich guy’s name. But husbands routinely hand everything over to their wives and treat it as “community” property. People can disagree with me on these things, but I’ve seen them again and again and again over several decades with my brother’s friends. I know I am right. There is a very different and less bonded, less profound “feel” to a gay male relationship than to your typical male-female marriage. Third, when gay men get sick, of AIDS for example, their party boy friends disappear within a few months. The people you will find at their bedsides are their mothers, their sisters, their female friends, and occasionally a father, brother, or good male friend or two. That has been my experience. Lots of gay men can vouch for me on this one, but unfortunately they are all dead. The living gay men probably don’t want to acknowledge that this is true and that they are surrounded by so much temporary “loyalty.” A life lived without women is not much of a life. </p>
<p>_____<br />
SH, your dilemma of wanting to show Christian love to people living in that lifestyle and yet making a stand for what our faith states is a real dilemma many Christians face. It is easy to jump to conclusions or to judge and condemn homosexuals or those living that lifestyle, when we need to remember too that heterosexuals are about as knee-deep in sins like fornication, sexual promiscuity and so on, and also, deep down inside, what homosexuals search for like all of us regardless of orientation is a need for meaningful relationship. Without meaningful relationship, all humans&#8211;homosexual, heterosexual, bisexual or whatever&#8211;are bound to fail in the way they understand themselves and their purpose in relation to God and the church too. </p>
<p>A few of my best friends are gay and live the homosexual lifestyle. Granted that some of them do not make the best of choices and enter relationships based more on the need to satiate sexual yearnings, with the element of the &#8220;utility&#8221; of human bodies thrown in(my best friend himself gets attracted to muscular men who are like himself, an alpha-male by American standards), I think that deep down inside, there is really an emptiness sitting in within the homosexual lifestyle, and it starts very much with the need for meaningful relationships of a platonic nature with the same sex for them. If many of them had been loved unconditionally regardless and despite of their sexuality, and loved for the image of God which still resides in them, then perhaps we as Christians would not have driven them away from the church and from Biblical scriptures as well, but would have admonished them in a way to come to seek healing in Christ.</p>
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		<title>By: Lilacs</title>
		<link>http://www.conversiondiary.com/2007/08/what-will-i-tell-my-gay-friends.html/comment-page-1#comment-41661</link>
		<dc:creator>Lilacs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Jan 2012 03:21:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gator1217.hostgator.com/~fulwiler/2007/08/what-will-i-tell-my-gay-friends.html#comment-41661</guid>
		<description>Oranur, I&#039;m praying for you.  God loves you!  I want to encourage you and Tienne and others to take a look at this website, it is written by a faithful gay Catholic man who&#039;s about 28.  Www.stevegershom.com  He discusses how to resist temptaion, how to deal with the rejection, self-denial, and suffering that comes with being a chaste gay Christian, and especially how to deal with depression.  I hope you are still reading this, and doing better.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oranur, I&#8217;m praying for you.  God loves you!  I want to encourage you and Tienne and others to take a look at this website, it is written by a faithful gay Catholic man who&#8217;s about 28.  <a href="http://Www.stevegershom.com" rel="nofollow">http://Www.stevegershom.com</a>  He discusses how to resist temptaion, how to deal with the rejection, self-denial, and suffering that comes with being a chaste gay Christian, and especially how to deal with depression.  I hope you are still reading this, and doing better.</p>
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		<title>By: Natalia</title>
		<link>http://www.conversiondiary.com/2007/08/what-will-i-tell-my-gay-friends.html/comment-page-1#comment-40570</link>
		<dc:creator>Natalia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Dec 2011 16:14:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gator1217.hostgator.com/~fulwiler/2007/08/what-will-i-tell-my-gay-friends.html#comment-40570</guid>
		<description>Thanks for the tip about that book! I will check it out!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for the tip about that book! I will check it out!<br />
<span class="cluv">Natalia recently posted..<a class="b9796ec6c8 40570" rel="nofollow" href="http://inspirationfile.wordpress.com/2011/12/04/re-agnostic/">Re: Agnostic</a></span></p>
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		<title>By: Jennifer Fulwiler</title>
		<link>http://www.conversiondiary.com/2007/08/what-will-i-tell-my-gay-friends.html/comment-page-1#comment-40550</link>
		<dc:creator>Jennifer Fulwiler</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Dec 2011 14:51:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gator1217.hostgator.com/~fulwiler/2007/08/what-will-i-tell-my-gay-friends.html#comment-40550</guid>
		<description>Great to hear from you, Natalia! I highly recommend the book The Good News about Sex and Marriage by Christopher West for answering those questions about NFP. The short version is: With NFP, you&#039;re not going out of your way to sever the life-giving properties of the sexual act - even if you&#039;re trying to avoid pregnancy, the possibility is still there. In a way, I think the answer to the &quot;why is NFP different than contraception?&quot; question is answered by the fact that everyone is so daunted by using it: It is *because* we realize that it preserves the life-giving possibilities of the act that we&#039;re so freaked out about it. :) Anyway, Christopher West does a better job with that question than I do, but that&#039;s some food for thought. Thanks for your comment!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great to hear from you, Natalia! I highly recommend the book The Good News about Sex and Marriage by Christopher West for answering those questions about NFP. The short version is: With NFP, you&#8217;re not going out of your way to sever the life-giving properties of the sexual act &#8211; even if you&#8217;re trying to avoid pregnancy, the possibility is still there. In a way, I think the answer to the &#8220;why is NFP different than contraception?&#8221; question is answered by the fact that everyone is so daunted by using it: It is *because* we realize that it preserves the life-giving possibilities of the act that we&#8217;re so freaked out about it. <img src='http://www.conversiondiary.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' />  Anyway, Christopher West does a better job with that question than I do, but that&#8217;s some food for thought. Thanks for your comment!</p>
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		<title>By: Natalia</title>
		<link>http://www.conversiondiary.com/2007/08/what-will-i-tell-my-gay-friends.html/comment-page-1#comment-40510</link>
		<dc:creator>Natalia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Dec 2011 15:44:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gator1217.hostgator.com/~fulwiler/2007/08/what-will-i-tell-my-gay-friends.html#comment-40510</guid>
		<description>Hi Jen, I just found your blog through a Catholic friend of mine. I am an Orthodox Christian, and although we share some similar views on the purpose of sex (and sex only within heterosexual marriage) there is some discordance between the Orthodox and Catholic views on contraception. Up until now I have always been really thankful that we Orthodox &quot;get off easy&quot; in some ways (we&#039;re supposed to plan for a family, but that doesn&#039;t mean every sexual encounter has to plausibly result in pregnancy, hence, after discussion with a spiritual father or mother it is plausible to use certain forms of birth control... but you probably know all this). Anyway, this particular argument for the reasons why the purpose of sex does not fit within homosexuality really has illuminated my mind to further understanding the purpose of sex itself. Thinking about it this way really makes sense, and I&#039;d been struggling to understand what was &quot;so wrong&quot; with homosexuality otherwise. 
Although I don&#039;t *want* to change my view since that is so hugely demanding, I&#039;m definitely going to be searching out this issue much more carefully. I don&#039;t really understand how NFP can be part of the equation though, if each time you have intercourse should be a possibility for pregnancy. How can it be okay to use NFP?
Anyway, most of all... THANK YOU for your excellent writing and argumentative skills and I really appreciate the honesty with which you tackle these issues!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Jen, I just found your blog through a Catholic friend of mine. I am an Orthodox Christian, and although we share some similar views on the purpose of sex (and sex only within heterosexual marriage) there is some discordance between the Orthodox and Catholic views on contraception. Up until now I have always been really thankful that we Orthodox &#8220;get off easy&#8221; in some ways (we&#8217;re supposed to plan for a family, but that doesn&#8217;t mean every sexual encounter has to plausibly result in pregnancy, hence, after discussion with a spiritual father or mother it is plausible to use certain forms of birth control&#8230; but you probably know all this). Anyway, this particular argument for the reasons why the purpose of sex does not fit within homosexuality really has illuminated my mind to further understanding the purpose of sex itself. Thinking about it this way really makes sense, and I&#8217;d been struggling to understand what was &#8220;so wrong&#8221; with homosexuality otherwise.<br />
Although I don&#8217;t *want* to change my view since that is so hugely demanding, I&#8217;m definitely going to be searching out this issue much more carefully. I don&#8217;t really understand how NFP can be part of the equation though, if each time you have intercourse should be a possibility for pregnancy. How can it be okay to use NFP?<br />
Anyway, most of all&#8230; THANK YOU for your excellent writing and argumentative skills and I really appreciate the honesty with which you tackle these issues!</p>
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		<title>By: Robert H.</title>
		<link>http://www.conversiondiary.com/2007/08/what-will-i-tell-my-gay-friends.html/comment-page-1#comment-38537</link>
		<dc:creator>Robert H.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Nov 2011 02:46:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gator1217.hostgator.com/~fulwiler/2007/08/what-will-i-tell-my-gay-friends.html#comment-38537</guid>
		<description>Thanks for sharing. You touched on a dimension that was unknown to me. Everyone needs to know more about gay issues and how deep they are. I think that is a start towards saving lives that don&#039;t have to be lost.

My prayers for strength and guidance for all people like you.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for sharing. You touched on a dimension that was unknown to me. Everyone needs to know more about gay issues and how deep they are. I think that is a start towards saving lives that don&#8217;t have to be lost.</p>
<p>My prayers for strength and guidance for all people like you.</p>
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		<title>By: Cindy</title>
		<link>http://www.conversiondiary.com/2007/08/what-will-i-tell-my-gay-friends.html/comment-page-1#comment-36509</link>
		<dc:creator>Cindy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Oct 2011 11:30:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gator1217.hostgator.com/~fulwiler/2007/08/what-will-i-tell-my-gay-friends.html#comment-36509</guid>
		<description>I have to agree with Mary.
  
There have always been men and women who never married; either by personal choice - or not.  The terms: old maid, spinster, and perpetual-bachelor come to mind. 

Many have the desire to marry, but aren’t able to because of physical, mental, and/or emotional disabilities, and/or physical deformities.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have to agree with Mary.</p>
<p>There have always been men and women who never married; either by personal choice &#8211; or not.  The terms: old maid, spinster, and perpetual-bachelor come to mind. </p>
<p>Many have the desire to marry, but aren’t able to because of physical, mental, and/or emotional disabilities, and/or physical deformities.</p>
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		<title>By: Carol</title>
		<link>http://www.conversiondiary.com/2007/08/what-will-i-tell-my-gay-friends.html/comment-page-1#comment-36101</link>
		<dc:creator>Carol</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Sep 2011 05:23:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gator1217.hostgator.com/~fulwiler/2007/08/what-will-i-tell-my-gay-friends.html#comment-36101</guid>
		<description>Jennifer, I just found your site today and am very impressed. I don&#039;t blog, I am aware that this post is a year too late, but I can&#039;t stop thinking about Oranur. My heart breaks for this man. If Oranur would walk up to me today, I would say, &quot;Oranur, God made you, God loves you and He has a plan for your life. Please don&#039;t despair.Don&#039;t take your life. I can see you are an intelligent, articulate man who loves the Lord and humanity. I will pray for you every day. We, as the body of Christ, need you here!&quot; I understand all the intellectual arguments about our gift of sexuality, but we need to begin by loving each other unconditionally. No one should feel so alone in the church. I hope this man is still alive.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jennifer, I just found your site today and am very impressed. I don&#8217;t blog, I am aware that this post is a year too late, but I can&#8217;t stop thinking about Oranur. My heart breaks for this man. If Oranur would walk up to me today, I would say, &#8220;Oranur, God made you, God loves you and He has a plan for your life. Please don&#8217;t despair.Don&#8217;t take your life. I can see you are an intelligent, articulate man who loves the Lord and humanity. I will pray for you every day. We, as the body of Christ, need you here!&#8221; I understand all the intellectual arguments about our gift of sexuality, but we need to begin by loving each other unconditionally. No one should feel so alone in the church. I hope this man is still alive.</p>
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		<title>By: Carolyn P.</title>
		<link>http://www.conversiondiary.com/2007/08/what-will-i-tell-my-gay-friends.html/comment-page-1#comment-34707</link>
		<dc:creator>Carolyn P.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Aug 2011 15:02:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gator1217.hostgator.com/~fulwiler/2007/08/what-will-i-tell-my-gay-friends.html#comment-34707</guid>
		<description>The Catholic church does not hate gay people at all.  They just will not and cannot accept sexual practices that are considered abominations to God.  It is crazy to think people are born gay.  God would not do that to someone!  And if you do research on the internet, there are MANY people who have repented of the gay lifestyle and now live 100% straight.  People, gay or not are all born innocent little babies.  Some people become gay later in life due to confusion, or sexual abuse (LOTS due to this), or from whatever social circle they end up in.  I am sure I will get some backlash here, but I will only say what I know is right, and right out of the Bible.  Jesus is JESUS, we cannot pick and choose out of the Bible what kind of God we WANT Him to be for us individually!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Catholic church does not hate gay people at all.  They just will not and cannot accept sexual practices that are considered abominations to God.  It is crazy to think people are born gay.  God would not do that to someone!  And if you do research on the internet, there are MANY people who have repented of the gay lifestyle and now live 100% straight.  People, gay or not are all born innocent little babies.  Some people become gay later in life due to confusion, or sexual abuse (LOTS due to this), or from whatever social circle they end up in.  I am sure I will get some backlash here, but I will only say what I know is right, and right out of the Bible.  Jesus is JESUS, we cannot pick and choose out of the Bible what kind of God we WANT Him to be for us individually!</p>
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		<title>By: Carolyn P.</title>
		<link>http://www.conversiondiary.com/2007/08/what-will-i-tell-my-gay-friends.html/comment-page-1#comment-34705</link>
		<dc:creator>Carolyn P.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Aug 2011 14:56:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gator1217.hostgator.com/~fulwiler/2007/08/what-will-i-tell-my-gay-friends.html#comment-34705</guid>
		<description>Hi, Jen, love your writing!  My issues with gay people is this:  Plain and simply, the Bible says homosexual acts are an abomination to God.  It is not judging for me to quote this, and if we&#039;re smart and God-fearing, we will take it seriously.  I have no problem with people-gay or straight-in general.  I hate absolutely no one, thank goodness.  BUT, I cannot and will not support the gay lifestyle.  As far as having gay friends, why not?  How can we as Christians witness to the very people who need it, if we run from them screaming in fear that their &#039;gayness&#039; is contagious.  Jesus commanded us to LOVE our neighbor, not try to love them.  Easier said than done, I know, but it&#039;s a practice Christians and everyone else in this world need to follow.  Blessings to you!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi, Jen, love your writing!  My issues with gay people is this:  Plain and simply, the Bible says homosexual acts are an abomination to God.  It is not judging for me to quote this, and if we&#8217;re smart and God-fearing, we will take it seriously.  I have no problem with people-gay or straight-in general.  I hate absolutely no one, thank goodness.  BUT, I cannot and will not support the gay lifestyle.  As far as having gay friends, why not?  How can we as Christians witness to the very people who need it, if we run from them screaming in fear that their &#8216;gayness&#8217; is contagious.  Jesus commanded us to LOVE our neighbor, not try to love them.  Easier said than done, I know, but it&#8217;s a practice Christians and everyone else in this world need to follow.  Blessings to you!</p>
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